Wheres the stats of the Xbox 360 return rate?

Wasn't it the biggest year yet for everyone?

Wasn't it the biggest year yet for everyone?

I'm pretty sure Sony is still hurting - and HOME isn't going to help it.

Nintendo absolutely dominated for another year, topped everyone by a fair lot. In fact just about everyone is saying that all the growth of the game industry this year has been driven by Nintendo alone. Fair show.

Nintendo: It's about quantity over quality.

Jack if you think HOME was created by 2 or 3 people, some of those Wii games that came out in '08 must of been created by rats in a maze.

OHNOEZ I JUST CAME UP WITH ANOTHER IDEA FOR A WII GAME

Quantity over Quality? True, but Sony has neither!

True, but Sony didn't market absolute filth like Carnival Games, All-Star Cheerleading, Celebrity Sports Showdown, Big Beach Sports, etc. like a 16 year-old Vietnamese whore.

Nintendo absolutely dominated for another year, topped everyone by a fair lot. In fact just about everyone is saying that all the growth of the game industry this year has been driven by Nintendo alone. Fair show.

I seriously don't agree with that. Releasing crappy games upon more crappy games is not progress, no mater how many people buy them. I think they're more likely to go the way of Atari.

Chiefy, Nintendo didn't make those games either. It's companies like Ubisoft and Activision that are doing most of it. I don't remember seeing you bitch and moan when Sony allowed tripe to flower on the PS1 and PS2. They were market leaders back then and the crap that got released on those systems when they were #1 was seen as a side effect of being the top selling console.

But suddenly it happens on the Wii and everybody suddenly becomes aware of all the shovelware that has heretofore been ignored by the community at large?

To be fair, shovelware has become more inticing with the added gimmick of wiggling and waggling. Parents and other aged persons (grandmas) have suddenly become more interested in going out and buying a new game for the toy box thing with the wiggle stick and the sports-a-majig because simply, everybody[/i] has heard about it.

Gone are the dark ages of "... Pee Ezz Two? ...", Gamebox and XCUBE. Everybody knows what a Wii is and what it does. Suddenly they don't feel like such an outcast when strolling through the game aisle because one look at [i]Big Beach Sports and you know what it's going to be about: "It's like Wii Sports on a beach! It must be the sequel."

Shovelware has become a bit more of a problem with the Wii. I wouldn't say it's hurting the market yet, but Nintendo's recent games have noticably been going downhill.

... Which is a shame, really.

Nintendo absolutely dominated for another year, topped everyone by a fair lot. In fact just about everyone is saying that all the growth of the game industry this year has been driven by Nintendo alone. Fair show.

I seriously don't agree with that. Releasing crappy games upon more crappy games is not progress, no mater how many people buy them. I think they're more likely to go the way of Atari.

Here, let me define growth for you: "the process of increasing in size". It is directly related to how many people are buying the products. Quote unquote "progress" has nothing to do with it. We all may wish that Nintendo spent more of its time encouraging hardcore games for its system, but the simple, undeniable FACT is that the Wii and its games have sold like hotcakes this year at a pace far outstripping the Xbox and PS3.

I was a n64/xbox fanboy. I know nothing of ps1 and ps2.  

The only time I owned a ps1 was for a couple of weeks when I bought a PS One, I played it for about 20 minutes. I bought a PS2 for SOCOM which was awesome, met some friends that I still game with today. Sold the PS2 after SOCOM 2 though and didn't get another until Julz and I decided to get a pack with GT4. I barely played that one too, eventually traded it in for our second 360. Our PS3 does all the backwards games now, but only Julz plays them.

So the thing is RJG, I was never a Sony fanboy, however I once loved what Nintendo made and stood for. Now it's just fad central.

I think the difference with PS1 and PS2 was that the shovelware weren't the best selling games on the console and there were plently of well made games to counter them. On the Wii the shovelware is reaching levels only paralleled by Atari back in the early 90's (or whenever it was that they went uber retarded).

They can sell as much as they like, but "growth" in the wrong direction isn't a good thing. Hopefully more of the companies follow suit with SEGA and try to make something that isn't obviously totally lame and crap. Until then I will continue to think the Wii is a waste of time and money.

I was with you up until you said SEGA is capable of making something that isn't lame and crap.

There's no such thing as bad growth. Growth is growth. More people playing games means more people looking for other games to play, means new 'hardcore' gamers means more sales of 'core' titles.

Maybe it's not the direction you wished the industry was growing in, but who are you to call it the 'wrong' direction?

If people are demanding poorly made titles like "Beach Bash" (I think I got the name right?) then companies are more likely to make more games like that and see less reason to make the games that take effort and are actually good. That's the growth I'm afraid of seeing. It's happened before where companies have just made shit game after shit game because that's where the market led it. I really don't want to see that happen again. Ironically, Nintendo was the company that got everyone out of that phase.

I was with you up until you said SEGA is capable of making something that isn't lame and crap.

I said try. At least they're having a go to change the trend.

When you get too much shovelware then typically you see a saturation of the market which forces people, at least for a while, to release other sort of games.

And yes, I would much rather play Carnival games or any of that shizz of HOME, simply for the fact that HOME is possibly the biggest steaming pile of monkey shit I've ever laid my hands on. And I've laid my hands on a lot of steaming piles of monkey shit.

And as for the comment that PS1 balanced Shovel with good stuff, Wii does that too. If you ignore the Wii because of the shovel you'll obviously miss the good stuff too.

Maybe it's balanced to a lesser extent because
1. They don't have the support of brands built on their last system like the PS2
2. Because unlike the PS1/64 generation there are now three consoles, so it's obviously going to be spread over that, with a lot of big name games appearing on 360 and PS3 since they're easier to port to each other and can still make big dollars. It's all driven by money.

I think you'll find that Mario & Sonic at the olympics and Big Beach Sports sold well due to the fact that most stores bundled them with the consoles at one stage or another.

I think you'll find that Mario & Sonic at the olympics and Big Beach Sports sold well due to the fact that most stores bundled them with the consoles at one stage or another.

M&S would have sold regardless.

I disagree, and I sell Wii's for a living.

I disagree, and I know how to use apostrophes correctly.

1) It's Mario.
2) The Olympics were a hot topic and approaching quickly.
3) It's Sonic.
4) Nintendo ran a big advertising campaign to capitalise on the sporting fever.

It would have sold regardless because the Olympics were going to be huge anyway. It couldn't not sell well.

It actually didn't sell very well at the time of the olympics. For my own sales, it would look something like this:

July: 5
August: 4
September: 4
October: 5
November: 25
December: 40

I doubt results from other stores would look much different.

You honestly think that the first joint Mario and sonic game wasn't going to sell? I obviously can't argue with your extensive sample size. I will point out that Australian sales don't equal world sales. The game had already been out for a while when the Olympics started but the game had already sold heaps. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_&_Sonic_at_the_Olympic_Games#Reception

Worldwide..

And there is nothing to say it would have been any different locally if they hadn't bundled it.

You said

[quote author=Julz link=topic=16361.msg177109#msg177109 date=1232681261]Hopefully more of the companies follow suit with SEGA and try to make something that isn't obviously totally lame and crap.

Which clearly suggests that you think SEGA is trying to make non-lame and crap games. Which games are you thinking of?

Sonic Unleashed is quite popular, and I thought it was pretty fun when I played it at work for a bit.

Oh yeah, and don't forget Mario & Sonic at the Olympics.

Sonic Unleashed is quite popular, and I thought it was pretty fun when I played it at work for a bit.

Oh yeah, and don't forget Mario & Sonic at the Olympics.

I own Sonic Unleashed, not through my own will though.

The daytime levels are the most fun I've had with a Sonic game in... ever.
The nighttime levels are atrocious and definitely warrant giving the game a 6/10 or maybe less.

SEGA aren't really trying to make a decent game; they're trying to make a decent gimmick. You can't really fault them though, they've stated they simply don't have enough money to produce a 6-8 hour long game of just daytime type levels.

This could be a lie to cover up the failure of their recent Were-Sonic gimmick thing but I kind of doubt it. A little.
They could try a bit harder to make a good game though. It's not like it has to be a Sonic game.

Sonic Unleashed is quite popular, and I thought it was pretty fun when I played it at work for a bit.

Oh yeah, and don't forget Mario & Sonic at the Olympics.

M&SatO is clearly lame. Sonic Team does not get a project greenlit unless it has a twist of some kind. They are clearly not listening to anyone's feedback. Lame.

Oh and I didn't mention M&SatO for a reason.

I mean, come on. Really?

Okay so.. The top selling games on Wii don't suck, but they do suck, but they don't suck, but they do suck?

I am not defending the Wii here.

It sucks.

Okay so.. The top selling games on Wii don't suck, but they do suck, but they don't suck, but they do suck?

Just because a game sells well doesn't make it good has nothing to do with if it is on the wii or not.

When I said SEGA were trying to make a game to change the pace of the Wii I was referring to Madworld. I don't know if this will be crap or not but at least they want to market something that isn't aimed at 8 year olds like many of the current games.

They're just publishing through. The developers are ex-Capcom. SEGA isn't really making it themselves in house - they just have the distribution channels Platinum Games wanted.

Do you get to use the balance board?